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Warren Castille · **09-02-2014, 07:33 PM**

You say that as if anyone on the field would recognize the difference between Succor and Conjury in the first place. If you WERE to be from the first line of non-Padjal White Mages, there'd be absolutely zero reason for you to broadcast that. A humble cloak and a stout staff would serve you just as well as your magic, and all anyone would know is that you were an able healer.

Reminds me of the olds myths about travelers passing Gods on the roads, disguised as humble beggars and travelers.

Faye · **09-02-2014, 07:49 PM**

We follow the lore because without it we're RPing in an undefined free-for-all of a fantasy kitchen sink universe where one person's canon is that only Padjal can become WHM's, someone else's canon is their character is the one special snowflake who became the only non-Padjal WHM, and another person's canon is that there's nothing special about being a WHM and anyone and everyone can become one. Put the three in a room together and you get immense IC confusion, narrative dissonance, and ultimately an OOC argument of Person A saying "we all need to follow the lore," Person B saying "only special people like me can break the lore," and Person C saying "screw the lore we should all do what I want."Â

I think it's pretty obvious why the causes problems and how following lore makes RP a smoother, less confusing, and less dramatic experience. Smile

Â However, I'm all for bending the lore where fit, and while I don't personally advocate breaking it I couldn't care less if someone does (if it bothers me that much, I won't RP with him/her, and that's the extent of it). I'm not trying to dissuade anyone from playing a WHM. I just think anyone who does needs to realize that A) They're breaking lore, B) They need to be prepared to face IC confusion/criticism from other characters for essentially breaking the laws of the universe, and C) They need to be aware of the possibility of the "lore nazis" screeching at them for violating the lore.

I also wouldn't personally advise taking the game's storyline as canon. According to the game's storyline, if you roll a WHM, you're the first non Padjal WHM and sure, it's not illogical that it could be the start of a trend and you're the first of many (unlikely, in that WHM are a rare thing to begin with, but hey, whatever). And according to the storyline, you also kill Gaius von Baelsur. I wouldn't take that as canon. You'll run into characters who are aiming to kill Gaius, characters who say that they already have killed him, characters who say he's still alive, and characters who say he's already dead. Personally, I'd rather distance myself/my character from the story's plot points as to not step on anyone else's toes nor have mine stepped on.

Gaspard · **09-02-2014, 08:13 PM**

(09-02-2014, 07:33 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: You say that as if anyone on the field would recognize the difference between Succor and Conjury in the first place. If you WERE to be from the first line of non-Padjal White Mages, there'd be absolutely zero reason for you to broadcast that. A humble cloak and a stout staff would serve you just as well as your magic, and all anyone would know is that you were an able healer.

Reminds me of the olds myths about travelers passing Gods on the roads, disguised as humble beggars and travelers.

Norse Mythology. Wodan and Odin.

As for the lore bit, I'd have to say I'm Pro-Lore, anti breaking it.

The reasons are pretty much the same as Fayes.

In any type of Roleplay community, no matter how you shape it, there has to be congruence between Your character, and all the characters you play with. As in; Absolutely everything must be the same for all characters in terms of laws of physics / the world setting / and so on, otherwise you create story paradoxes that destroy immersion with the snap of the finger.

HOWEVER. (and this is the big flipside of it)

Adhering to Lore does 'not' mean you're usually limited, or forced to play an average joe. For Example, a white mage is nothing else then a Glorified Healer in certain aspects (but i'm not too clear on WHM lore, so sue me). If it is said glorification you seek (no matter whether it's publicly advertised as some type of wunderkind phenomena) or just a detail you'd like to have for yourself, You can always find ways to achieve that by avoiding the label 'WHM'. You could simply go with something along the lines that your character has received a direct blessing from Nophica upon birth, making anything related to healing ar Conjury her second nature.

In the end, WHM is nothing but an elitary title to describe a handful of conjurers with a special aptitude/heritage. To create something alike, or that functions similarly, without touching the WHM powerderkeg is quite easy. It just takes a bit of clever shifting to achieve what you look for.

FreelanceWizard · **09-02-2014, 09:00 PM**

One thing I'd point out, as others have noted, is that it's in no way a decided issue that White Mage is a class that players can't play without falling into "special snowflake or lore breaker" territory. There's several threads (some locked Cry

) that go into detail on the various arguments on both sides and the support from lore for both. Without making a statement on which camp I fall into, I'd simply advise that there's very strong feelings on the issue and that RPing being a White Mage has a high probability of causing problems.

As for the WHM lore, there's a big difference metaphysically between a White Mage and a Conjurer -- but that in no way prevents you from playing a powerful, skilled healer using Conjury, Arcanima, or both.

SayonaraRevival · **09-02-2014, 09:12 PM**

what lore breaking is as opposed to lore bending tends to be subjective when in smaller doses. that's what I'll have to figure out. how to bend the lore a smidge to suit me and the people that I will end up RPing with, rather than break it outright.

I think I should also say that it takes a whole lot from any of my characters to keep me interested long-term, so I don't get tired of a character before I even finish developing them. that's why I'm not about to start with a personally less interesting character. it's all a matter of views and personal preferences, anyway. I'll just say again, my most successful OCs in any place, with everyone, have always had that special-snowflake risk. if I knew what I was doing right away, I probably wouldn't have even needed to ask the question, haha. hence asking and a little paranoia, orz

personally, in regards to the suggestions, I'm most likely to do something similar to WHM without actually being a proper WHM. either way, bless that ignorance is bliss, because there's no need for glory over on my end by way of titles. I'd rather get glory for having an interesting character, but y'know, gotta make one before I can have one.

I don't know how everyone at large rolls, but I'm going to play through the story first, before I decide what to do, haha. until I play through the rest, I won't be sure how to approach it. I'm still in the development process, so I'm not too worried about it, and probably won't 100% finish the development process until I start seeing more cutscenes with the important figures and such.

(and on another note, I have a feeling this character would be far more likely to be friends with the sylph than the Gridanians... I am totally going after that Sylph-Friend title when I get up there in levels. whoo, lv24 as of today.)

either way, delicious ideas and feedback are wonderful, thanks to everyone for giving me their views and opinions! (and ideas in some cases.)

Faye · **09-02-2014, 09:27 PM**

As Gaspard suggested, being something of an "unofficial" white mage is perfectly fine and more or less what I've done with Faye to skirt around the issue. Big Grin

Â She's certainly not WHM material, but through diligence and pure stubbornness she's managed to tap into holy magic enough to cast something akin to the spell Holy. Otherwise, she's just your average conjurer, and not recognized by anyone--even herself--as a WHM.

Warren Castille · **09-02-2014, 09:37 PM**

(09-02-2014, 09:12 PM)SayonaraRevival Wrote: whoo, lv24 as of today

Worth pointing out. It's easy to forget sometimes we're not all vets who've done multiple class stories, some more than once.

LiadansWhisper · **09-02-2014, 09:38 PM**

It should be noted that the signature WHM spell - Holy - is one of the most destructive spells in the game, according to the lore. Â It's heavily implied that Holy is what was destroying the land when the conflict between Black Mage and White Mage nearly caused the world to end (and ended an Astral Age).

That said, you can play whatever you want.

It's entirely possible to be an extremely powerful Conjurer. Â White Magic is supposed to be nearly godlike, however, and capable of what-should-be-impossible feats of healing and the like.

I suppose we can hope that at some point SE will realize their mistake and go back to the 1.0 version of the questline.

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **09-03-2014, 12:59 PM**

The RP we did yesterday was fun/interesting! ...I'm gonna try to keep Franz around the Shroud more often, since there are more viable methods of transportation to allow such.

Among other things, you now have a wiki entry as well! (well, sorta. I try to add all the people Franz has held a conversation with onto it as a big contact sheet) Smile

Berrod Armstrong · **09-03-2014, 01:31 PM**

(09-02-2014, 09:38 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: It should be noted that the signature WHM spell - Holy - is one of the most destructive spells in the game, according to the lore. Â It's heavily implied that Holy is what was destroying the land when the conflict between Black Mage and White Mage nearly caused the world to end (and ended an Astral Age).

That said, you can play whatever you want.

It's entirely possible to be an extremely powerful Conjurer. Â White Magic is supposed to be nearly godlike, however, and capable of what-should-be-impossible feats of healing and the like.

I suppose we can hope that at some point SE will realize their mistake and go back to the 1.0 version of the questline.

*Side-eyes Raya-O-Senna spamming Holy*

Ooh girl you doin' it wrooong...shame on you! Shave off them horns!

SayonaraRevival · **09-03-2014, 06:44 PM**

lmao, I think the whm thing is probably not a big worry for now, since until further notice I'll play what I know, aka Conjurer -- so I would rather see people take that debate and/or comments on the subject to another thread, if it is possible to request that. since this is a thread more for people to offer to RP with me a little so I can kinda trial-and-error character design. (I didn't mean to run into a wall of controversy, woops.)

thanks for the RP/wiki page mention, Franz!! it was fun to talk to someone who rolls with the punches, and also helps me figure out how the weird should be manifested properly so it will be what I'm trying to make it. and will look forward to talking to you again if we can make a time sometime! might have some time tomorrow evening, lol 9 - 5:30 work day. )': should be home by 6pm pst though, if not 5:45pm.

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **09-03-2014, 11:28 PM**

(09-03-2014, 06:44 PM)SayonaraRevival Wrote: and will look forward to talking to you again if we can make a time sometime! might have some time tomorrow evening, lol 9 - 5:30 work day. )': should be home by 6pm pst though, if not 5:45pm.

Any time! ...if you happento see my online and I'm not in a duty, there's a very high chance I'm free. Send me a /tell any time. (And I'll try to return the favor)

g0ne · **09-04-2014, 06:50 AM**

Hi!

I'm still strutting around Gridania and the Shroud, despite having the game for a while now. First, it was the obnoxious installation and patching (Of course, quite a few are witness to that!), and now there's the added burden of college.Â Dodgy

I'm totally up for RPing! Truth be told, though, I haven't RPed yet myself, so it should be a learning experience for me too, and it'll help me flesh out and get to know Eleni as well. The problem is that I will only be available on the weekends! (Hey, but it's close!Â Big Grin

Â )

On the white mage thing, I have to agree with Edgar. Why can't it be that after a first non Padjal WHM, others followed? And from the posts, I get that a WHM is very special, and being one would make your character kind of unique, but I don't know, I think it should be okay to RP a WHM. I know I won't mind if I meet a WHM IC, and if anything, I'll actually support it. (Oh, dear, I hope no one runs after me with torches and pitchforks after this!Â Undecided

Â )

That said, I hope to see you around in about a day, and some hours. Approximately 30 hours from now, I'll be online! (Hopefully!) Looking forward to meeting you, and to RPing with you!

ps. I typed this from my phone, and I'm too lazyÂ Tongue

Â to check if there are any errors, so excuse any that exist!

Yangh · **09-04-2014, 07:21 AM**

I echo what Liadan said. WHM are not only unique but... insanely powerful! Lore or not... I'd avoid RPing one simply because i'd be so damn tempted to smite everyone with Holy! xD

Hey look! A Miqo'te is hitting on me

*holy*

*blinks*

*sips drink*

*wags tail*

:3

g0ne · **09-04-2014, 09:38 AM**

Wow, this issue on White Mages is particularly sensitive, isn't it?Â Surprise

I'm not a lore scholar (hey, I'm still relatively new and learning, and I will continue to try and learn as much as I can) but by reading all the posts in this thread, I learnt new stuff, and I guess it's a good idea to just stick to the lore, huh? (And please correct me if I ever make a mistake in the lore departmentÂ Undecided

Â )

Still, powerful conjurers can be powerful, right?Â Big Grin

That brings up the question, though, why would SE put players in such a predicament? Either let non Padjal be a WHM (and not just one special cookie out of everyone else), or not make WHM such a big thing?

ps. I hate posting through my phone.Â Dodgy

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