+- Hydaelyn Role-Players (https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/mybb18)
+-- Forum: Community (https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/mybb18/forumdisplay.php?fid=8)
+--- Forum: RP Discussion (https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/mybb18/forumdisplay.php?fid=13)
+--- Thread: Flying Mounts and You (/showthread.php?tid=11790)
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Erik Mynhier - 05-27-2015
Fury (my chocobo) will be receiving Airborne training as I expect many others will. As for flying around existing areas in rp... have been for years in airships.... we all have. There are airship ports with npc's coming and going in every major city.
To say flight is WoL only is silly. From the looks of the info we have been given, only the WoL has been given access to Ishgard... not the general public, but you bet your ass we are all going to handwave that and all of (balmung) eorzea is going to pile into the Holy See. Same with flight, even if for some stupid reason its lore to only be a WoL thing, we are all honestly going to handwave it. Its the nature of cool new features locked behind lore.... we say "F! the lore".
RE: Flying Mounts and You - TheLastCandle - 05-27-2015
I'm taking the "wait and see" approach for Yvelont. It depends on how the MC is introduced to flying mounts in the Heavensward MSQ. Like Bryn, I want that gryphon IC, but only if it makes sense in context.
For Hibito, with personal airships being a thing, you'd better believe he'll be shooting for the stars.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Coatleque - 05-27-2015
I will accept them as canon of course. I'll probably get one(1) so I can continue leveling and reach new content. I will most likely NOT use them myself in-character. Crofte has no reason to go anywhere that requires flight (yet). She doesn't even have her own chocobo, she just rides a borrowed Flames mount if necessary.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Hyrist - 05-27-2015
In the battle of Single Player Lore (which is the MSQ) vs individual character gameplay? Gameplay will win more times than lose.Â
For something as big as setting restrictions, however, it's better to stick with what is visibly accessible (Like, you can't Fly in ARR yet, so no swooping in on a Griffon until you can actually swoop in on a Griffon.)
Granted, this is all subject to the Canon Circles concept.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Qhora Bajihri - 05-27-2015
(05-27-2015, 12:19 PM)Hyrist Wrote: It's established canon that one cannot fly unless attuning to a flight stone to catch the currents in the air.
So, without that function in the ARR zones, I won't be accepting flight (aside from Airships, perhaps) outside of Heavensward zones, until such can be done in the game proper. At that point I'd roleplay that whatever was necessary to have mounts be able to fly (as established by SE at that time or in headcannon) has happened and accept RP flying mounts in ARR zones.
As far as accepting it in Heavensward - at face value. They've written a story on how it's established, I assume that Aether usage can be considered the scapegoat on how a PC can maintain themselves on their mounts, and the same with helping odd creatures, such as Fat Chocobos fly.
This is what I heard and how I figured it will go. Flying will have explanations for why it happens in Heavensward zones. Imagining a chocobo flying over Ul'dah without significant help from aether/these new fancy air current things is going to be a hard sell on believability, but as for whether or not they can fly once the explanations are in place, I'm not going to have a problem with the flight capability of everything that can fly. It'll just be dependent on environment, I assume.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Chris Ganale - 05-27-2015
(05-27-2015, 11:32 AM)Telluride Wrote: In fact, SE is going to have to spend a little time enforcing to us that flying mounts are terribly rare if they expect us to continue to take a LOT of their lore seriously. The reintroduction of air power in Eorzean hands (remember - Airships are RARE right now and Garlean Air Power is part of their threat) is a major plot point that.... well, I'm gonna be that guy and say it. I don't think SE is going to have thought this all the way through, but I will accept pleasant surprises, because frankly, I WANT to be wrong about it.
Oh I already plan to take glorious, amazing advantage of their not having thought this through. I'm the guy who's going to take the single-man airships, 11 of my friends, and turn this shit into Ace Combat Eorzea.
(05-27-2015, 01:36 PM)Aya Wrote: Honestly, I'm left wondering why Chocobo mounted flying cavalry haven't dealt with the Dravanian threat (and Garlean airships) centuries ago.
Because dragons still have maneuver superiority to chocobos and basically anything else we could put into the sky, and would shred any 'airborne chocobo cavalry' with laughable contempt. The Garleans wouldn't even have to laugh, because no weapon that can be carried by a man on bird-back is capable of penetrating their armor.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Aya - 05-27-2015
(05-27-2015, 04:01 PM)Chris Ganale Wrote:Quantity has a quality all its own! Given that Dragoons are capable of defeating Dragons on the ground, the advantages of air cavalry should be obvious!(05-27-2015, 01:36 PM)Aya Wrote: Honestly, I'm left wondering why Chocobo mounted flying cavalry haven't dealt with the Dravanian threat (and Garlean airships) centuries ago.
Because dragons still have maneuver superiority to chocobos and basically anything else we could put into the sky, and would shred any 'airborne chocobo cavalry' with laughable contempt. The Garleans wouldn't even have to laugh, because no weapon that can be carried by a man on bird-back is capable of penetrating their armor.
In terms of the Garelans...! They never think anything can penetrate their armor. But how wrong they are! Now we'll be able to have mounted gun-wielding cavalry to support the lancers. It would be glorious ruin to all Chocobo-enemies! Eorzea shall dominate Hydelaen as once did the Mongol Hordes our world!!!
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Chris Ganale - 05-27-2015
While I'm sure Garlean armor plating on their airships isn't the same as 600mm of composite steel, ceramics, kevlar, and depleted uranium, the pithy little guns that a MCN carries isn't going to penetrate. Assuming a slight increase in weapon size to accomodate for being able to mount it turret on a flying creature (no flying mount in existence is going to be able to carry proper cannon), it still won't do much more than irritate them.
Sorry to come across as negative nancy and counter to good fun, but I take munitions and airframes seriously. Having handled munitions for the Air Force probably has a lot to do with that.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Aya - 05-27-2015
(05-27-2015, 04:17 PM)Chris Ganale Wrote: While I'm sure Garlean armor plating on their airships isn't the same as 600mm of composite steel, ceramics, kevlar, and depleted uranium, the pithy little guns that a MCN carries isn't going to penetrate. Assuming a slight increase in weapon size to accomodate for being able to mount it turret on a flying creature (no flying mount in existence is going to be able to carry proper cannon), it still won't do much more than irritate them.If what you were saying actually applied in FF, the Garelans would have actually conquered Eorzea by now. I think you're accepting Garelan propaganda at face value (and assuming that their air ships lack weaknesses in their armor, lets not forget that they're still... AIRSHIPS which are not exactly known to be the most rugged vessels ever created, even in Fantasy).
Sorry to come across as negative nancy and counter to good fun, but I take munitions and airframes seriously. Having handled munitions for the Air Force probably has a lot to do with that.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Telluride - 05-27-2015
(05-27-2015, 04:23 PM)Aya Wrote:(05-27-2015, 04:17 PM)Chris Ganale Wrote: While I'm sure Garlean armor plating on their airships isn't the same as 600mm of composite steel, ceramics, kevlar, and depleted uranium, the pithy little guns that a MCN carries isn't going to penetrate. Assuming a slight increase in weapon size to accomodate for being able to mount it turret on a flying creature (no flying mount in existence is going to be able to carry proper cannon), it still won't do much more than irritate them.If what you were saying actually applied in FF, the Garelans would have actually conquered Eorzea by now. I think you're accepting Garelan propaganda at face value (and assuming that their air ships lack weaknesses in their armor, lets not forget that they're still... AIRSHIPS which are not exactly known to be the most rugged vessels ever created, even in Fantasy).
Sorry to come across as negative nancy and counter to good fun, but I take munitions and airframes seriously. Having handled munitions for the Air Force probably has a lot to do with that.
"Hello, Eorzean. I am a Garlean in an airship. Surrender."
"Hello, Garlean. I am a Summoner, and this is Garuda-Egi, my buddy. How's your vessel for wind-shear?"
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Chris Ganale - 05-27-2015
I'm basing my judgment off their big ships, not the dumbass-looking single-man pogo sticks. The Agrius and the ones that look like they took an old WW2-era battleship and put a levitation drive in it.
Am I saying they're invincible? No. But can a mechanist with a couple of up-sized versions of his main hand grafted to the side of a chocobo take one down solo? Also no. Until and unless Eorzea acquires some serious firepower in the way of armor-piercing munitions, the only surefire tactics for downing one of their big airships is to board it and destroy it from within (something they're uniquely weak to given their large open-air observation decks) or have a dozen thaumaturges commit suicide by way of completely expending all their aether to magic the hell out of it.
(05-27-2015, 04:29 PM)Telluride Wrote: "Hello, Eorzean. I am a Garlean in an airship. Surrender."
"Hello, Garlean. I am a Summoner, and this is Garuda-Egi, my buddy. How's your vessel for wind-shear?"
Having leveled my first character alongside a summoner and seen pretty well what an egi can do, I doubt a SMN's Garuda can sink one either. Make life difficult for them? Sure. But then they hit you with a cannon.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - allgivenover - 05-27-2015
It's not wise to get into real world viability of weaponry when swords, bows, and spears are going toe to toe with guns and winning. The Garleans would have crushed Eorzea ages ago if not for aether allowing people to break the rules.Â
Guns > everything.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Aya - 05-27-2015
(05-27-2015, 04:31 PM)allgivenover Wrote: It's not wise to get into real world viability of weaponry when swords, bows, and spears are going toe to toe with guns and winning. The Garleans would have crushed Eorzea ages ago if not for aether allowing people to break the rules.ÂExactly. And adding air mobility to the equation on the Eorzean side (which could already win while trapped on the ground) should completely tip the scales (which is why it doesn't make much sense to me as anything but a very special snowflake (such as the WoL) capability).
Guns > everything.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Chris Ganale - 05-27-2015
Aether imbuement has its limits. By that very logic, if it was that all-powerful, then we'd have slapped Garlemald in their collective dicks already and sent them home with a stern no.
RE: Flying Mounts and You - Zyrusticae - 05-27-2015
(05-27-2015, 01:36 PM)Aya Wrote: So, I don't really know about the particulars of flying in Heavensward. It may juts be strictly limited to the WoL? I figured its probably a more general thing from the way its being discussed here, and that's always been my assumption, but anyway, it certainly colors my feelings on FF XIV flight.
I honestly don't much care for flight in MMO's, I think it has a tendency to detract more than add. I especially feel like the idea of chocobos (or other obviously land bound creatures) flying is immersion and mood breaking in this game. Yeah, magic, blah, blah, blah, that's really not my point. You see a Fat Chocobo flying and have to accept it as canon and all of a sudden it feels like there's no reasonable frame of reference with which to take in the game world any more. Its just silliness, which is all good and fun in its time and place, but I feel like it creates an incredible amount of friction with the feel of Eorzea they've otherwise created.
Honestly, I'm left wondering why Chocobo mounted flying cavalry haven't dealt with the Dravanian threat (and Garlean airships) centuries ago.
Quote:It's established canon that one cannot fly unless attuning to a flight stone to catch the currents in the air.I missed this, and.. but.. no, I really won't know what to think of it until I see it and how prevalent it is. There's still this whole.. sea of clouds thing that I can't quite wrap my head around either...
Anyway, there's no chance that Aya herself will fly. Except by airship!
Yep, this is pretty much my feelings exactly.
Aether-powered flight is all well and good, but those tiny stubby little wings flapping so hard... or worse, the GIGANTIC fat 'bos with those tiny wings? It looks dumb, it feels wrong, and I just can't accept that. I'll probably have T'rahnu act nonplussed about them (as she is about many strange things in Eorzea), but OOCly I will always see them as an eyesore and hope and pray that most players use more credible mounts for flight instead.
Personal airships are fine. I like those. At least they look cool. Flightless birds suddenly taking flight? Worse yet, gigantic fat ones? No. No, thanks.