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+--- Thread: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing (/showthread.php?tid=9999)
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Zhavi - 02-06-2015
Hmm, after reading this thread . . . you know, I play both male and female characters. Most of the people I rp with play both male and female characters. It doesn't matter to me.
That said, coming at someone and telling them or insinuating that they're weird, and creepy, and wrong for preferring one thing or another is doing the exact same thing to them that you feel they're doing to you. You'd likely get much better results pming the person and asking why they feel that way, did they have a bad experience, and just seeing why they feel that way (as Melkire said -- could just be he feels that female writers write better female characters and vice versa) as opposed to making them feel unwelcome and harangued.
Like, this isn't even really a discussion about which is better done from an objective perspective -- it reads like people reacting defensively to a statement he made and then him trying to defend himself and back out of the argument. Not really great grounds for an open and productive discussion, imo.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Warren Castille - 02-06-2015
(02-06-2015, 04:08 PM)Kage Wrote: I think a few of us have asked this before but...
If it's not romantic RP, why does it matter?
In fact, why does it matter if almost all of your interaction is just IC? What does the gender behind the screen matter over what the character on-screen does? If the roleplay and story is well-written, does it truly matter?
I mean unless it's going into cybering etc I don't see why there is ever a need to know who the player behind a character is.
You're not wrong.
But neither is he.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - K'nahli - 02-06-2015
(02-06-2015, 03:45 PM)Faye Wrote: We have tried to explain what's strange about it, you just keep shouting, "PREFERABLY!!!!" and aren't reading what we're saying.And no, asking for "Preferably a bard" isn't weird, assuming you mean a bard IC, as I don't think any of us are bards OOC, just as asking for a female IC isn't weird. Asking for a female OOC kind of is. I'm not telling you that you need to change your opinion. RP however you want to RP. If you can't stand the thought of RPing with another dude, that's kinda weird bro, but you do you. I'm just trying to point out how it comes across as odd and is only narrowing your audience here...
Regardless of my own personal thoughts on the matter, and with respect, terms like "weird" will likely only come across as antagonistic even if you do reinforce his freedom to do so with "you can do as you like" - especially since the OP isn't getting much support with his side of the opinion.
It's possible that he's not much interested in discussing his opinion so much as defending it but I'm not sure if there is much else anyone can say to help emphasise that they only meant to help and advise. I think it's better you not stress yourself over the debate anymore, haha ^^Â At least in the original OP's case.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Gegenji - 02-06-2015
![[Image: tumblr_inline_n97cb84XJa1ri2379.jpg]](https://media.tumblr.com/8549ab3d380d54e6d28cb80d146a916e/tumblr_inline_n97cb84XJa1ri2379.jpg)
(I HAD TO DO IT)
In all seriousness, though, I can kinda see where the original poster is coming from on this? As it's been mentioned, and hinted through some of the other comments about possible romance (and ERP), he may want to pursue closer relations between the two characters. And the fact that the person playing that cute Seeker Miqo'te he's having his character make out with is actually a dude might make him feel uncomfortable. Even if that's not the case and he just thinks girls RP girls better and boys RP boys better, both views are still understandable.
But, as has also been mentioned, it's still between the characters. Unless you're seeking to also try to develop an OOC relationship as well, it... really doesn't matter, does it? It's a fictional character interacting with another fictional character - and in that fictional setting, it's a guy and a girl dating or making out or what have you regardless of the puppetmasters controlling the strings. Perhaps if you're worried about the answer of the question, maybe just don't ask? It seems like a cop-out, but it might be better to just assume the character's controller has the proper bits rather than risk... misunderstanding and the fallout from said misunderstanding.
I dunno. This whole topic strikes me as kinda being too easy to swerve into the skeevy.
(I just really, really wanted to use that image.)
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - TheLastCandle - 02-06-2015
For me, personally, if I don't like/don't fit a person's request for RP I simply, you know, choose not to roleplay with them. I do it quietly, without publicly making assumptions about the person making the request. They may have perfectly valid reasons based on past experiences. Why start a bunch of drama over what amounts to a personal choice? If someone states they prefer to play with a female, then people fitting that description will either be interested and contact that individual, or.. they won't. Seems pretty cut and dry to me, anyway.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Kage - 02-06-2015
(02-06-2015, 04:09 PM)Warren Castille Wrote:Did I say he was? In fact most of my statements are very generic now. I don't even care what the [initial] OP was about because I'm not here to discuss it. I am only repeating what a few general opinions have been stated in threads that have come from similar situations.(02-06-2015, 04:08 PM)Kage Wrote: I think a few of us have asked this before but...
If it's not romantic RP, why does it matter?
In fact, why does it matter if almost all of your interaction is just IC? What does the gender behind the screen matter over what the character on-screen does? If the roleplay and story is well-written, does it truly matter?
I mean unless it's going into cybering etc I don't see why there is ever a need to know who the player behind a character is.
You're not wrong.
But neither is he.
The Love Love Maid Café advertisement thread last year was pretty much ripped to pieces in the RPC forums, from the RPers here, as many found it to be not to their tastes and most likely not to what they want in RP. In fact, I'm of the opinion that most people did not post in the thread because of A) Sargatanas and B) memories of the thread from last year.
Am I surprised whenever I meet a female player behind a male character? Well, sure just because I love it whenever I get to meet a fellow female player. Am I surprised about male players behind female characters? Honestly, not completely. Do I care? Not an ounce unless they start moving into asking me about IRL things about me and not my character. I don't give one flying fuck if it's a middle aged 30 year old man or a 30 year old woman. My character is RPing the scene with another character.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Kamome - 02-06-2015
There are a lot of assumptions and unfounded accusations happening about the OP-OP in this discussion. He explicitly stated that he wasn't looking for OOC feelings to bleed through and that he has a wife. All we can do is take someone on their word, and we can choose not to participate in something if it raises red flags in our head. Acting abrasively, without evidence, especially colored by our past experiences, is just going to create endless, irrational conflict.Â
That said, I'm with Faye on this one in that it makes me uncomfortable to seeing ERP OK and OOC female-preferred in the same solicitation. I don't know where this conversation can go, though, considering different things make different people uncomfortable. Something making you, personally, uncomfortable doesn't make it okay to lash out at someone, either.
Personally, I am a woman and I like playing male characters, as well as female. It's wonderful to be able to write and play a compelling character of either gender because gender-blind casting isn't realy mainstream in popular entertainment.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Zhavi - 02-06-2015
(02-06-2015, 04:13 PM)Gegenji Wrote: I dunno. This whole topic strikes me as kinda being too easy to swerve into the skeevy.
It boggles me that people feel comfortable making all sorts of assumptions about him, and are creeped out by him, and yet feel utterly no desire to understand why he stated what he stated.
If it was reverse, and someone had posted 'prefer the person playing the woman to be a man' I highly doubt people would have reacted so strongly. I understand that sometimes you get burned when a rp partner finds out you're playing cross-gender and disappears, but this is not the same person as those who may have done you a bad turn in the past. (unless you have had a bad experience with him, in which case, excuse me)
This thread bothers me, because it is skating ever so close to the edge of double standards.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - OttoVann - 02-06-2015
I romanced with males behind the screen and women, and it was all IC so who cared about their gender. In fact now that I think on it all the women who were behind the screen for my romance RP were married, like me. Im not sure why they are to be preferred a woman. They arent going to be your girlfriend through rp.
However, I guess I can sort of understand not wanting to erp with a guy on his catgirl. Im as hetero as it comes, but I also dont mix ic and ooc so...
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Warren Castille - 02-06-2015
(02-06-2015, 04:19 PM)Kage Wrote:(02-06-2015, 04:09 PM)Warren Castille Wrote:Did I say he was? In fact most of my statements are very generic now. I don't even care what the [initial] OP was about because I'm not here to discuss it. I am only repeating what a few general opinions have been stated in threads that have come from similar situations.(02-06-2015, 04:08 PM)Kage Wrote: I think a few of us have asked this before but...
If it's not romantic RP, why does it matter?
In fact, why does it matter if almost all of your interaction is just IC? What does the gender behind the screen matter over what the character on-screen does? If the roleplay and story is well-written, does it truly matter?
I mean unless it's going into cybering etc I don't see why there is ever a need to know who the player behind a character is.
You're not wrong.
But neither is he.
The Love Love Maid Café advertisement thread last year was pretty much ripped to pieces in the RPC forums, from the RPers here, as many found it to be not to their tastes and most likely not to what they want in RP. In fact, I'm of the opinion that most people did not post in the thread because of A) Sargatanas and B) memories of the thread from last year.
Am I surprised whenever I meet a female player behind a male character? Well, sure just because I love it whenever I get to meet a fellow female player. Am I surprised about male players behind female characters? Honestly, not completely. Do I care? Not an ounce unless they start moving into asking me about IRL things about me and not my character. I don't give one flying fuck if it's a middle aged 30 year old man or a 30 year old woman. My character is RPing the scene with another character.
Maybe it's just me projecting, then, but the inferred tone in this thread seems to be aggressive towards an opposing viewpoint. Fuck, my post said you aren't wrong, which you seem to be okay with, but then you reiterate the whole debate over the other half of my point being that he's not wrong either. I'm not accusing anyone of anything.
The "general opinions" in this thread are borderline hostile. Repeating them, moreso.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Faye - 02-06-2015
Don't get me wrong, I understand that most of the time women are better at writing female characters and men are better at writing male characters. There are toooons of exceptions to that rule, though, or the difference is often to slight it doesn't really matter. It's kinda the same as saying "preferably not a bad RPer." If quality of RP is what he's concerned about, why not just say that instead? Probably because it's kinda off-putting to read even if you fully understand where someone is coming from.
In my personal experience, I've had a ton of problems with lesbian catgirls played by RL men in their 30's. That seems like a weirdly small and niche group, I know, but it's surprising how many characters fall into that category, and every one I've met has been interested in three things: stirring up buttloads of drama OOC like they're living their secret fantasy of being a high school girl, seeking out tons of ERP, and spending what time isn't dedicated on the first two things godmodding, being a Mary Sue, and trying to make their character be the ultimate badass. I've ran into this type in XIV so often it isn't even funny. But if I put "Looking for RP friends, preferably not a lesbian catgirl played by a 30-year-old man," once people realized it was actually serious and not a joke, they'd probably find it preemptively judgmental and offensively discriminatory... because it is.
Bad RPers are bad RPers. There are much worse offenses than someone who can't write well for the gender of the character they're playing. I'd much sooner tack up "No godmodders" or "No Mary Sues" or "No OOC crazies who will cause buttloads of drama." So if it's for the sake of preserving RP quality, I don't understand why someone's RL gender is the most serious potential problem.
And I'm sorry if calling it "weird" seems antagonistic, but that's just how it is. I'm not sure what words would be better. Sketchy? Strange? Shady? Suspicious? Sexist? All have pretty negative connotations that may upset someone, which makes sense, given that it's a negative feeling. It's difficult to find positive words for negative things.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Kinono - 02-06-2015
Kino and her husband are fictional characters.
Kino and her husband are opposite genders.
Kino and her husband are played by two separate people.
These people are the same gender.
These people do not posses sexualities where they would be attracted to each other in real life at all.
These people do not care about the previous two lines because of the first line.
The end.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Gegenji - 02-06-2015
(02-06-2015, 04:22 PM)Zhavi Wrote:(02-06-2015, 04:13 PM)Gegenji Wrote: I dunno. This whole topic strikes me as kinda being too easy to swerve into the skeevy.
It boggles me that people feel comfortable making all sorts of assumptions about him, and are creeped out by him, and yet feel utterly no desire to understand why he stated what he stated.
*snip*
This thread bothers me, because it is skating ever so close to the edge of double standards.
That's kinda more what I mean. While some of the way it was presented leans one way, that doesn't mean what he intended. However, it's easy enough for the thread to derail into the topic of what he said rather than what he meant. Which leads to "skeevy" (i.e. sketchy, dangerous, flame-attracting) discussion over the importance of who is sitting behind the other screen.
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - Zhavi - 02-06-2015
(02-06-2015, 04:29 PM)Gegenji Wrote: That's kinda more what I mean. While some of the way it was presented leans one way, that doesn't mean what he intended. However, it's easy enough for the thread to derail into the topic of what he said rather than what he meant. Which leads to "skeevy" (i.e. sketchy, dangerous, flame-attracting) discussion over the importance of who is sitting behind the other screen.
My apologies, sir!
RE: [Split] Gender Behind the Writing - OttoVann - 02-06-2015
I think one thing to consider, I just had this thought cross my mind as I was making a sandwhich.
I think perhaps, what a lot of people reacted to was a sort of subliminal "This is asking for trouble" to the OPs request. People who may not be able to easily rp with other men on catgrills might not be ready for romance RP.