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+--- Thread: Retconning (/showthread.php?tid=8711)
RE: Retconning - Verad - 10-20-2014
Retconning is fine. Do it freely and as necessary. In an effort to avoid doing so, I tend to avoid making characters that interact very heavily with the metaphysics of the setting. I rarely play magic-users until I know very well what the rules for magic are in any RP environment, especially MMOs, because I know I will get something wrong that will have to be fixed later.
But the notion of "deleting/changing" the character when there's some critical lore error - who says this? Is there anybody who actually advocates this? "Sorry, you got some unanswered area wrong, reroll?"
RE: Retconning - Aya - 10-20-2014
(10-20-2014, 01:32 PM)Verad Wrote: But the notion of "deleting/changing" the character when there's some critical lore error - who says this? Is there anybody who actually advocates this? "Sorry, you got some unanswered area wrong, reroll?"I would say "I do!" but sometime tells me Verad wouldn't believe me :-]
I think there are people that adopt this attitude, but only to be trolls.
RE: Retconning - FreelanceWizard - 10-20-2014
Honestly, if I got a major lore point seriously wrong and that point of lore were key to the character concept, I'd probably throw the character away and start over -- not that I'm advocating others do this, of course! If, for instance, I wrote a character who was a high mage for a powerful Ishgardian house acting as a diplomat to the rest of Eorzea on that house's behalf, and we were to find out in 3.0 that no such things could possibly exist (for instance, mages are all part of the church, Thaumaturgy is banned, or spellcasters aren't allowed any political power), I'd probably ditch the character entirely.
That said, I generally try to keep speculative bits minimal, vague, or easily removed so I don't have to worry about this. I like to think I have enough experience to guess where devs are likely to clobber and where they aren't.
RE: Retconning - Warren Castille - 10-20-2014
I don't know. In the event something like that turns out to be completely wrong, I think trying to dig out could lead to more interesting RP. If your Ishardian High Sorcerer ends up becoming impossible... Why not heel-turn the character? He was a lying liar from Liesville the entire time.
Your secret Garlean-spy was a double agent the whole time and was trying to dig up enough evidence before turning the cell over to the Flames/Adders/Maels.
Your White Mage isn't actually channeling Succor - they might have just thought they were, and it was just conjury (because who would have ever been healed enough by conjurers and the few white mages to even have a comparison?) or perhaps they were selling snake oil, trying to bring prestige onto themselves by riding on the coat tails of the actually powerful.
Throwing away a character is just a waste of a potential story no one saw coming.
RE: Retconning - FreelanceWizard - 10-20-2014
I guess the issue for me is that I may not want to do a face heel turn (or, depending on the character, a heel face turn; this is Ish-"It's Called Witchdrop For a Reason"-gard we're hypothesizing about, after all
). If I were really into the character concept, having to alter it dramatically in a way that turns the character into a bad guy, a liar, or a fraud might not sit well with me. Sure, it opens up RP possibilities, but they may not be possibilities I want to explore.
RE: Retconning - Warren Castille - 10-20-2014
(10-20-2014, 02:58 PM)FreelanceWizard Wrote: I guess the issue for me is that I may not want to do a face heel turn (or, depending on the character, a heel face turn; this is Ish-"It's Called Witchdrop For a Reason"-gard we're hypothesizing about, after all
Well, true.
I'm just the type to knock over the Jenga tower before putting it back in the box. It was going to fall apart anyway, might as well have some fun with it first!
RE: Retconning - Aldotsk - 10-20-2014
Some people end up playing like DnD and force themselves to recreate their character as if they fill out a new sheet to reroll their character because the character died in the game or campaign. I remember doing this for WoW private servers ( thank god I didn't pay for this) and regular WoW server. Luckily I refused to do it for FFXI and people were okay with it. Though I was considering to reroll anyways because there was someone in linkshell that was shame naming with racism OOCly and I didn't want to play as that character or be part of that linkshell in Sylph.Â
But yeah , sometimes people end up rerolling if their character ends up getting really messy that you can't do anything to change it. It's like you filled up that paper all over the place in pen ink and it's hard to even use white out.
RE: Retconning - Ares D'Argent - 10-20-2014
(10-20-2014, 02:38 PM)FreelanceWizard Wrote: Honestly, if I got a major lore point seriously wrong and that point of lore were key to the character concept, I'd probably throw the character away and start over -- not that I'm advocating others do this, of course! If, for instance, I wrote a character who was a high mage for a powerful Ishgardian house acting as a diplomat to the rest of Eorzea on that house's behalf, and we were to find out in 3.0 that no such things could possibly exist (for instance, mages are all part of the church, Thaumaturgy is banned, or spellcasters aren't allowed any political power), I'd probably ditch the character entirely.
That said, I generally try to keep speculative bits minimal, vague, or easily removed so I don't have to worry about this. I like to think I have enough experience to guess where devs are likely to clobber and where they aren't.
(10-20-2014, 02:43 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: I don't know. In the event something like that turns out to be completely wrong, I think trying to dig out could lead to more interesting RP. If your Ishardian High Sorcerer ends up becoming impossible... Why not heel-turn the character? He was a lying liar from Liesville the entire time.
Your secret Garlean-spy was a double agent the whole time and was trying to dig up enough evidence before turning the cell over to the Flames/Adders/Maels.
Your White Mage isn't actually channeling Succor - they might have just thought they were, and it was just conjury (because who would have ever been healed enough by conjurers and the few white mages to even have a comparison?) or perhaps they were selling snake oil, trying to bring prestige onto themselves by riding on the coat tails of the actually powerful.
Throwing away a character is just a waste of a potential story no one saw coming.
(10-20-2014, 02:58 PM)FreelanceWizard Wrote: I guess the issue for me is that I may not want to do a face heel turn (or, depending on the character, a heel face turn; this is Ish-"It's Called Witchdrop For a Reason"-gard we're hypothesizing about, after all
Totally agreed with Freelance here. Â Sadly this is what happened to me with my character concept. Â I was very interested in it because it appealed to me greatly, however upon learning that it would be impossible to do I did scrap the entire character mid-way through his storyline. Â Just the only difference is that I didn't restart because my motivation suffered a crippling blow that I couldn't recover from.
RE: Retconning - Roswyn - 10-20-2014
(10-20-2014, 12:33 PM)Aya Wrote: The lore for this world is on the light side, and has been well stated, many characters live within the "Grey" areas.Â
I feel like this whole conundrum gets avoided if you just stick to known lore and not tryhard with really out there characters.
Pretty much what Aya said.
RE: Retconning - Verranicus - 10-20-2014
Knowing Ishgard reveals were all but a sure thing in the coming patches I purposely held back on pushing my characters current storyline/whatever you wanna call it.
I always find it funny when people run away with stuff the game gives little to no information on with their characters and then either have to backpedal to the point of losing weeks/months of RP or keep RPing a then non-canon thing despite it.
I'm waiting for more information on Othard/Doma/the Far East to come out down the road to show how silly it is for all of these people with japanese-y names to be running around claiming to be from there.
RE: Retconning - Aduu Avagnar - 10-20-2014
as to the garlean mages, I could have sworn it was established in 1.0 that pure-blooded garleans were unable to use magic.
RE: Retconning - Verranicus - 10-20-2014
(10-20-2014, 06:25 PM)Nako Wrote: as to the garlean mages, I could have sworn it was established in 1.0 that pure-blooded garleans were unable to use magic.The official lore says pure-blooded Garleans generally can't use magic and any mages you see are conscripts or from conquered territories. However, magic using pure-blooded or half-blooded Garleans aren't impossible, just very VERY rare.
So even if it's possible, don't try to be a special snowflake and do it anyway.
RE: Retconning - Aduu Avagnar - 10-20-2014
(10-20-2014, 06:36 PM)Verranicus Wrote:well, that was before the lore panel, it is now stated categorically that they can't. and besides nothing has /ever/ stopped people that want to be a special snowflake from doing it.(10-20-2014, 06:25 PM)Nako Wrote: as to the garlean mages, I could have sworn it was established in 1.0 that pure-blooded garleans were unable to use magic.The official lore says pure-blooded Garleans generally can't use magic and any mages you see are conscripts or from conquered territories. However, magic using pure-blooded or half-blooded Garleans aren't impossible, just very VERY rare.
So even if it's possible, don't try to be a special snowflake and do it anyway.
RE: Retconning - Parvacake - 10-20-2014
I don't really have anything I have to worry about much with Lili in regards to the newly revealed lore. I think the most is that her and her previous mate talked about having children a lot at one point, but since we both thought having children between races wasn't possible it became an interesting topic between them. But it's also something I've seen open a lot of door for crossrace couples I've seen who thought that they couldn't mate either who are now excited that lore wise that is a possibility.
There's also those who are just going to stick with what they've been doing whether it's lore certified or not simply because it's what they've been doing for so long. It's become such an ingrained part of their story that taking it away might alter everything.
Alas, it's something that's going to vary from character to character and circumstance to circumstance.
RE: Retconning - Berrod Armstrong - 10-22-2014
(10-20-2014, 06:36 PM)Verranicus Wrote:The lore panel stated that it's genetically impossible for them to.(10-20-2014, 06:25 PM)Nako Wrote: as to the garlean mages, I could have sworn it was established in 1.0 that pure-blooded garleans were unable to use magic.The official lore says pure-blooded Garleans generally can't use magic and any mages you see are conscripts or from conquered territories. However, magic using pure-blooded or half-blooded Garleans aren't impossible, just very VERY rare.
So even if it's possible, don't try to be a special snowflake and do it anyway.
Nako, it was established that they were unable, yes! The question on the lore panel was more of 'why'. To that, they answered that it was a genetic thing!