(05-22-2017, 12:04 AM)Sig Wrote: I've considered each and every counter argument and disagree. 

(05-22-2017, 12:18 AM)Oswin Wrote: Thank you for the clarification! And I had forgotten about the zoning issues, hot damn what a mess. I think it's safe to say we should be expecting similar at launch.

(05-22-2017, 12:21 AM)Nako Vesh Wrote:

(05-22-2017, 12:04 AM)Sig Wrote: I've considered each and every counter argument and disagree. 

How can you disagree with hardware limitations though? These limits exist whether you believe in them or not. The strain on the entire Aether datacenter continues with or without the power of you imagination. 

People with expertise are telling you on a concrete, material level that sustaining Balmung is physically impossible. Unless you have invented some quantum servers and are ready to roll them out right now (and even then, I don't know). . .

Quote:Nothing else will work.

(05-22-2017, 12:23 AM)EliBallard Wrote:

(05-22-2017, 12:21 AM)Nako Vesh Wrote:

(05-22-2017, 12:04 AM)Sig Wrote: I've considered each and every counter argument and disagree. 

How can you disagree with hardware limitations though? These limits exist whether you believe in them or not. The strain on the entire Aether datacenter continues with or without the power of you imagination. 

People with expertise are telling you on a concrete, material level that sustaining Balmung is physically impossible. Unless you have invented some quantum servers and are ready to roll them out right now (and even then, I don't know). . .

Yeah, but.. he disagrees.

(05-22-2017, 12:16 AM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:

(05-21-2017, 11:28 PM)Oswin Wrote: This is a very good point as well but I would like to clarify that it's on a different server level. Correct me if I'm wrong, Merc, but from my understanding as a Sys Admin the instance servers are more like a server farm that is connected to all the other Aether servers. Realistically, there should be enough servers to handle the load. If we go by the server limit it should be able to handle 7,500 players per server. Divided up Aether should be able to handle that load.

If I had to guess (well, an educated guess based on people's work doing packet analysis and reverse engineering on both 1.0 and 2.0 server architecture), our instance servers are nearly identical to our normal zone servers. They likely just have a different set of scripts on them and the client handles the rest of the connections.

FFXIV utilizes a number of different servers at different stages of gameplay. I'll go over a few in text and then I'll link in a handy picture (and edit the post) for a basic explanation of the server setup that's likely in place.

FFXIV uses the following (and likely more than one)

Authorization Server - your login credentials
Patch Server - self explanatory

Once you've logged in on the launcher, it creates your basic session credentials, which are passed to the FFXIV game client. (Which is why you can't just run ffxiv.exe directly). For security's sake, I'll omit what that looks like. 3rd party launcher do exist (not including bots). They're insecure and not really useful if the real launcher is working.

Once the game is running, you'll notice that it had initially asked you which datacenter you wanted to play on. This is important! It it was brings you to the next step of gameplay.

Lobby Server - This is what loads your account information based off the session created from the Auth server and and game client. Traffic is encrypted now! (Good job SE. Don't turn that off again.)

The Lobby Server handles everything until you actually get in game. It handles selecting other data centers (new lobby server), making/deleting/editing characters, and eventually passing off your session over to the next server in charge of things.

World Server - These are the named worlds. Balmung, Gilgamesh, Mateus, whatever. This server handles global functions in the game for all players connected to it. Things like your linkshells, party, free company, market boards, retainers, and more! You are ALWAYS connected to this server. At the same time, it's rapidly passing data to a series of additional servers you might also be connected to. We're not sure, but status effects are probably stored in this server's working memory, even if they get handled below.

Zone Server - Also known as Map servers, Instance servers, and probably a few more things. This server is where the magic really happens. It's what sends the game client constant updates on what you see and can interact with. All of the game's actors (players, mobs, npcs, interactable objects) exist in this level. It has a TON of things to do and also has to make sure it broadcasts that to every player connected. It's also needs to check in with the World Server to make sure that your chats and party information are synced. And that's on top of running all the events, scripts, monster AI, FATEs, hunts, and other cool things that make the game work.

Now, there are multiple zone servers. There has to be or the game would only be able to support a very meager amount of connections. (Think like less than 1000). If you ever got that error message saying "cannot enter zone" it's because this server's overworked for that area. Most likely, we've got at least one of these for every map in the game and possibly per housing ward, although it's entirely possibly all wards are compressed together and that particular zone server just knows how to keep them separated from each other. (FFXIV supported creating private instance areas layered on top of normal maps. This is how levequests, instance battles, and inn rooms are handled, for example!)

--

Now, what happens when a server's full? There are multiple places this can happen!

The world is full. The world server's unable to handle more connections in a safe manner. This could mean the maximum amount of concurrent connections are all being used, it could mean that it's not able to broadcast packets to all players, and it can also mean that it's getting stressed from too much context switching if it's connecting/disconnections thousands of players at a time to try to keep up with all its global functions.

The zone is full. Mostly explain above already, that particular zone instance is maxed out. It can't reliably broadcast packets for everything it needs to do in a timely manner because of CPU/network constraints.

--

So why can't SE just give a world server or a particular zone server more resources? It doesn't work that way. When the lock these servers down, it's largely due to network contraints. I've explained this in earlier posts already, but there's no way to allocate more or "better" network connections to a server. When a server gets stressed in these situations, that typically means it's time to go into load balancing or to restrict how many connections are allowed. (FFXIV has done both!)

Who remembers the split zones when 3.0 launched? I do! It was a MESS. This was an early attempt from SE to get multiple zone servers handling the same area. (Good on them. Their architecture allowed them to do this!) If any of you remember, it'd arbritrarily select a zone for you. Didn't get grouped with your party? Too bad so sad. The zone servers were split to make sure they could keep running. Not for your party and/or group! In some games, players re given the option to switch between these instances. (Sometimes referred to as a shard or channel). But this only works if the zone server can accept more connections to start.

OK. Picture time. It uses some different names, but I believe you all. Please.


(credit to the FFXIV private server projects. This one came from FFXIV Classic).

This is a basic illustration of only a single World/Zone server cluster. Since at this point in the game, there's no reason to be connecting to the authorization server or lobby server. (But who knows. FFXIV might keep the lobby server too since it likes to kick us back often. ...or the session lasts a REALLY long time and that's how the Chinese bots hacked the game once.)

(05-22-2017, 12:16 AM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:

(05-21-2017, 11:28 PM)Oswin Wrote: This is a very good point as well but I would like to clarify that it's on a different server level. Correct me if I'm wrong, Merc, but from my understanding as a Sys Admin the instance servers are more like a server farm that is connected to all the other Aether servers. Realistically, there should be enough servers to handle the load. If we go by the server limit it should be able to handle 7,500 players per server. Divided up Aether should be able to handle that load.

If I had to guess (well, an educated guess based on people's work doing packet analysis and reverse engineering on both 1.0 and 2.0 server architecture), our instance servers are nearly identical to our normal zone servers. They likely just have a different set of scripts on them and the client handles the rest of the connections.

FFXIV utilizes a number of different servers at different stages of gameplay. I'll go over a few in text and then I'll link in a handy picture (and edit the post) for a basic explanation of the server setup that's likely in place.

FFXIV uses the following (and likely more than one)

Authorization Server - your login credentials
Patch Server - self explanatory

Once you've logged in on the launcher, it creates your basic session credentials, which are passed to the FFXIV game client. (Which is why you can't just run ffxiv.exe directly). For security's sake, I'll omit what that looks like. 3rd party launcher do exist (not including bots). They're insecure and not really useful if the real launcher is working.

Once the game is running, you'll notice that it had initially asked you which datacenter you wanted to play on. This is important! It it was brings you to the next step of gameplay.

Lobby Server - This is what loads your account information based off the session created from the Auth server and and game client. Traffic is encrypted now! (Good job SE. Don't turn that off again.)

The Lobby Server handles everything until you actually get in game. It handles selecting other data centers (new lobby server), making/deleting/editing characters, and eventually passing off your session over to the next server in charge of things.

World Server - These are the named worlds. Balmung, Gilgamesh, Mateus, whatever. This server handles global functions in the game for all players connected to it. Things like your linkshells, party, free company, market boards, retainers, and more! You are ALWAYS connected to this server. At the same time, it's rapidly passing data to a series of additional servers you might also be connected to. We're not sure, but status effects are probably stored in this server's working memory, even if they get handled below.

Zone Server - Also known as Map servers, Instance servers, and probably a few more things. This server is where the magic really happens. It's what sends the game client constant updates on what you see and can interact with. All of the game's actors (players, mobs, npcs, interactable objects) exist in this level. It has a TON of things to do and also has to make sure it broadcasts that to every player connected. It's also needs to check in with the World Server to make sure that your chats and party information are synced. And that's on top of running all the events, scripts, monster AI, FATEs, hunts, and other cool things that make the game work.

Now, there are multiple zone servers. There has to be or the game would only be able to support a very meager amount of connections. (Think like less than 1000). If you ever got that error message saying "cannot enter zone" it's because this server's overworked for that area. Most likely, we've got at least one of these for every map in the game and possibly per housing ward, although it's entirely possibly all wards are compressed together and that particular zone server just knows how to keep them separated from each other. (FFXIV supported creating private instance areas layered on top of normal maps. This is how levequests, instance battles, and inn rooms are handled, for example!)

--

Now, what happens when a server's full? There are multiple places this can happen!

The world is full. The world server's unable to handle more connections in a safe manner. This could mean the maximum amount of concurrent connections are all being used, it could mean that it's not able to broadcast packets to all players, and it can also mean that it's getting stressed from too much context switching if it's connecting/disconnections thousands of players at a time to try to keep up with all its global functions.

The zone is full. Mostly explain above already, that particular zone instance is maxed out. It can't reliably broadcast packets for everything it needs to do in a timely manner because of CPU/network constraints.

--

So why can't SE just give a world server or a particular zone server more resources? It doesn't work that way. When the lock these servers down, it's largely due to network contraints. I've explained this in earlier posts already, but there's no way to allocate more or "better" network connections to a server. When a server gets stressed in these situations, that typically means it's time to go into load balancing or to restrict how many connections are allowed. (FFXIV has done both!)

Who remembers the split zones when 3.0 launched? I do! It was a MESS. This was an early attempt from SE to get multiple zone servers handling the same area. (Good on them. Their architecture allowed them to do this!) If any of you remember, it'd arbritrarily select a zone for you. Didn't get grouped with your party? Too bad so sad. The zone servers were split to make sure they could keep running. Not for your party and/or group! In some games, players re given the option to switch between these instances. (Sometimes referred to as a shard or channel). But this only works if the zone server can accept more connections to start.

OK. Picture time. It uses some different names, but I believe you all. Please.


(credit to the FFXIV private server projects. This one came from FFXIV Classic).

This is a basic illustration of only a single World/Zone server cluster. Since at this point in the game, there's no reason to be connecting to the authorization server or lobby server. (But who knows. FFXIV might keep the lobby server too since it likes to kick us back often. ...or the session lasts a REALLY long time and that's how the Chinese bots hacked the game once.)

(05-22-2017, 12:37 AM)Oswin Wrote: Another point to make about the coming free transfers.

Guys, they are giving out game time to get off the server. SE is throwing away those of dollars to get the hell off Balmung. They are willing to eat that loss. Let that sink in as well.

 EXPLOSION!

 At it's current rate Balmung is in serious trouble.