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+--- Thread: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? (/showthread.php?tid=11578)
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Jonexe - 05-12-2015
It's an odd design choice, and not one I necessarily like... but...
It doesn't take weeks to grind out getting through Steps of Faith.Â
Personal story time:
I resubbed three weeks ago. Most days I don't do any content and just RP. In that time I went from an ilvl 63 WHM to an ilvl105 WHM and cleared the main story content having not played since before 2.1. In total I probably put 6 hours towards the main story in each week. I finished up Steps of Faith at ilvl96 on Saturday.
Gearing is pretty easy with a mix of dungeons, crafting, Soldiery Tomes, Labyrinth of the Ancients/Syrcus Tower runs. The last two there are exceptionally nice, since now you can run them endlessly while they're unlocked. Every run gives Soldiery and Poetic Tomes, as well as chances at gear. Additionally, each takes maybe 30~45 minutes since most people significantly out gear it and make it a breeze.Â
The hardest part, I would say, is if you don't have a level 50 class yet. That's what is going to take the most amount of time. Once you get to 50 (especially if you already have must-have cross class skills) it amounts to just accomplishing a lot of quests; 90% of which are pretty easy "talk to this guy, that guy, that other guy, then come back" quests.
The required trials are fairly easy all the way up to Steps of Faith, which was just recently nerfed (and might be again by the time Heavensward releases). Take 3 minutes while waiting in queue to watch a video for each trial and you very likely won't have a problem with any of them.
Not everyone will get done quite as quickly as I did (roughly 18 hours), as I got pretty lucky on some drops in ST. Some will get through faster, some slower, etc. But! If you start now and put in an hour or two a day towards it, you can be ready for Heavensward before early access even begins.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Mae - 05-12-2015
(05-12-2015, 05:44 PM)Oswin Wrote: In the grander FF MMO string of things, this is not unusual. It was common in XI to have some sort of gated quest line before you would be able to do expansion content, refereed to as Limit Breaks. These were not soloable quests either, they required grinding and groups to accomplish. Some even required rare items from hunts and raids.They were also required every 5 levels.Limit Breaks were for leveling, only. A level 50 (highest level you can achieve without doing chores for Maat) -could- complete quite far into various expansion storylines with a group of high-leveled friends without breaking a single level cap. There were no items from raids (since XI didn't have raids), none needed from HNMs. There were two Burning Circle fights, any other item needed dropped from regular mobs. Sometimes you needed parties to get items, but you certainly didn't need one for running around towns and handing out items you'd been receiving since level 1 >_>
-- Core Game, you could progress quite far through the Nation Missions provided you had friends to carry you. I personally had my airship pass (a rank 4 mission, meaning the recommended level to complete is 40) at level 20 because I had a friend drag me around by the back of my harness.Â
-- Rise of the Zilart (first XI expansion) storyline required a Shadow Lord kill (a rank 5 mission from Core), but you had access to various zones provided you could survive running to them.Â
-- Chains of Promathia (second expansion), the first mission became available at level 25 regardless of where you are in Core and RotZ. Tavnazia access was gated behind the Promyvions (level 30 content), but other zones were accessible provide you could survive running to them. Some dialouge changed if you had completed RotZ and Core. "Apocalypse Nigh" was the ONLY mission that required you had completed RotZ, and it was technically an optional mission.
-- Treasures of Aht Urghan, your ability to access any of it depended on a short rep grind with a Core faction and farming a couple items to access. Solo, you could get this done as early as level 18. With a high level friend to help, you could get it done at level 1.
-- Wings of the Goddess... lowest level I've personally escorted through the Maws was a level 30, I think. So... at least level 30, and not dependent of the previous expansions.
-- ACP,ASC, and the Moogle add-on mini-expansions, you can flag as early as 30. And doesn't require previous expansion progression.
-- Abyssea... welll..... if you've played XI since Abyssea was released, then you KNOW about Abyssea Leeches.
-- Far West expansion (I am totally drawing a blank on it...), again accessible by at least 30. Independent of all the other expansions.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Warren Castille - 05-12-2015
That's so inaccurate as to the actual game, though. It'd be like me saying "You didn't NEED item level in XIV; if you entered T13 before the enforced ilvl cap you could do it in your AF and white items!"
Sure, you could "do" XI content at level 30. No, you wouldn't have actually contributed anything to the fights. You'd get carried.
I don't consider being carried through content completing it.
Edit: Sure, Dynamis Lord was killable at level 65!
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Blue - 05-12-2015
(05-12-2015, 06:34 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: That's so inaccurate as to the actual game, though. It'd be like me saying "You didn't NEED item level in XIV; if you entered T13 before the enforced ilvl cap you could do it in your AF and white items!"
Sure, you could "do" XI content at level 30. No, you wouldn't have actually contributed anything to the fights. You'd get carried.
I don't consider being carried through content completing it.
Edit: Sure, Dynamis Lord was killable at level 65!
You are thinking of endgame. FFXI endgame was completely aside from story missions, and it actually had a reasonable level requirement too to be completed. We're talking about access to basic things such as exploration and job quests here.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Warren Castille - 05-12-2015
(05-12-2015, 06:18 PM)Mae Wrote: -- Core Game, you could progress quite far through the Nation Missions provided you had friends to carry you. I personally had my airship pass (a rank 4 mission, meaning the recommended level to complete is 40) at level 20 because I had a friend drag me around by the back of my harness.Â
Aside from the level cap 50 on Rank 5, everything after required (or suggested) you being as high as you could, only possible with limit breaks.
Quote:
-- Rise of the Zilart (first XI expansion) storyline required a Shadow Lord kill (a rank 5 mission from Core), but you had access to various zones provided you could survive running to them.Â
Zilart require you to complete rank 5-2, and the zones they sent you to had enemies from 51-75.
Quote:-- Chains of Promathia (second expansion), the first mission became available at level 25 regardless of where you are in Core and RotZ. Tavnazia access was gated behind the Promyvions (level 30 content), but other zones were accessible provide you could survive running to them. Some dialouge changed if you had completed RotZ and Core. "Apocalypse Nigh" was the ONLY mission that required you had completed RotZ, and it was technically an optional mission.
Infamous for its difficulty, completing CoP without being carried required every member of the party to be a very specific job/subjob, and carry above-average gear for them. That is, if you didn't farm the super-rare crafted items to debuff the boss. It would remain this way for years after release, making completion of CoP an actual stand-out accomplishment for a long, long time. It also required you to be at the proper level to complete it at numerous checkpoints, culminating in a level 75 fight (and a prior, level 60 fight that outright wiped you if you failed the DPS check).
Quote:-- Treasures of Aht Urghan, your ability to access any of it depended on a short rep grind with a Core faction and farming a couple items to access. Solo, you could get this done as early as level 18. With a high level friend to help, you could get it done at level 1.
The first zone ToAU spits you into is abound with enemies beginning at level 57. The ones that aggro went as low as 61, if I remember correctly. You couldn't actually DO anything there, any more than someone who runs to Northern Thanalan at level 1 can do anything in that zone.
Also, I can guarantee you weren't farming Cursed Skulls solo at 18.
Quote:-- Wings of the Goddess... lowest level I've personally escorted through the Maws was a level 30, I think. So... at least level 30, and not dependent of the previous expansions.
Even worse, the enemies in the WotG zones were all much higher. There were some low level enemies around you could exploit for BST or BLM exp (and in the case of the W.Ronfaure Colibri camp, EXP on from 37-41) but that again was leveling content, not content content. You couldn't actually lay a mark on anything in campaign if you weren't in your high 50s with generous gear.
Quote:-- ACP,ASC, and the Moogle add-on mini-expansions, you can flag as early as 30. And doesn't require previous expansion progression.
All required level 75 or above to complete.
Quote:-- Abyssea... welll..... if you've played XI since Abyssea was released, then you KNOW about Abyssea Leeches.
Leeching EXP (from level 75+ enemies, which are impossible to kill at lv30) is again not representative of the actual content. The lowest level enemies in Abyssea zones again approaches or exceeds the level cap, required a carry to "do" anything.
Quote:-- Far West expansion (I am totally drawing a blank on it...), again accessible by at least 30. Independent of all the other expansions.
Seekers of Adoulin. Enemies all approach level 100+. Can't do jack at level 30.
It's obvious, but I'm a longtime XI player. I dislike it greatly when people gloss over how rip-your-teeth-out-with-a-rusty-pair-of-pliers the actual content was. You're ignoring the content in favor of leveling, which again, required Genkais to complete.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Warren Castille - 05-12-2015
(05-12-2015, 06:52 PM)Blue Wrote:(05-12-2015, 06:34 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: That's so inaccurate as to the actual game, though. It'd be like me saying "You didn't NEED item level in XIV; if you entered T13 before the enforced ilvl cap you could do it in your AF and white items!"
Sure, you could "do" XI content at level 30. No, you wouldn't have actually contributed anything to the fights. You'd get carried.
I don't consider being carried through content completing it.
Edit: Sure, Dynamis Lord was killable at level 65!
You are thinking of endgame. FFXI endgame was completely aside from story missions, and it actually had a reasonable level requirement too to be completed. We're talking about access to basic things such as exploration and job quests here.
Endgame and content were synonymous, unless you count clearing a one-time fight as content.
In that case, SoF is most definitely content.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Chris Ganale - 05-12-2015
(05-12-2015, 06:54 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: XI insanity
Good fucking god, I'm glad I got out of that bullshit when I did.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Warren Castille - 05-12-2015
(05-12-2015, 07:08 PM)Chris Ganale Wrote:(05-12-2015, 06:54 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: XI insanity
Good fucking god, I'm glad I got out of that bullshit when I did.
DON'T EVEN START ME ON LAND KINGS
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Chris Ganale - 05-12-2015
(05-12-2015, 07:12 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: DON'T EVEN START ME ON LAND KINGS
I have no idea what that is but what it's saying to me is "THIS GAME SUCKS, BE GLAD YOU LEFT IT".
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Warren Castille - 05-12-2015
(05-12-2015, 07:15 PM)Chris Ganale Wrote: I have no idea what that is but what it's saying to me is "THIS GAME SUCKS, BE GLAD YOU LEFT IT".
Trufax: XI was probably the most sublimely rewarding, most significant experience of my life.
...that sounds really sad, but trust me.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Kaniko Niko - 05-12-2015
Every single thing Warren post is true. I played for about two and a half to three years post-Chains of Promathia. I completed maybe one Promyvion and never even set foot into the new continent/zone Tavnazia. I've never managed to get to Sea or Sky, either. And to be fair, I never really even made it above 70.
In the time when most of the people did Promyvion, there was ZERO reason to go back and with how unrepentantly brutal the game was at the time, people wouldn't accept insurance gil against the EXP pool for a carry.
And I agree with him. The game was sick, twisted and brutal. You couldn't pay me to play it again or recommend the old version to anyone.
But those six or so years are days I count among my most cherished.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Telluride - 05-12-2015
Meh, add me to the list of people thinking that it's a massively bad decision forcing people to have to get ilvl 90 AND beat Steps of Faith to get to most of the goodies they forked out a lot of money to get.
I'll stop before I say how I really feel about it, which involves a lot of questionable linguistics that my old professors would not have allowed me to present as research topics.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Kellach Woods - 05-13-2015
I think the moment I heard someone say "you can't level past 10 without a party" I went hahahahahahahaha who designs a game like that square you're on crack.
and thus is the story on how I never played XI.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Aduu Avagnar - 05-13-2015
I understand gating the MSQ behind it, however, I don't personally agree with gating the entire region/classes behind it.
But I can confirm what Jonexe said, he beasted it out no problem.
RE: Heavensward Ilevel Requirements. Strange Design Choice? - Aya - 05-13-2015
Gating things behind the MSQ remains my greatest complaint about this entire game. Its the main reason why, when people ask me about it, I reply that its a terrible game with a terrific community. That's just my opinion, but I'm honestly neither surprised nor pleased that they're sticking to it in Heavensward. Oh well
