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AST-related lore questions - Goodfellow - 04-22-2015

Alright, I know everyone is at a fever-pitch regarding the paucity of concrete lore around Heavensward and the new jobs...and so am I.  I have no judgment or counsel to offer.  But I at least would like to get as much of it in one place, for myself, as I'm able.

As I see it, there are two (maybe two-and-a-half) major (major!) lore areas where I'm uncertain/foggy when it comes to what little we know about astologians.

1) Sharlayan:  Astrologians aren't Ishgardian!  Who knew?  I know very little of Sharlayan's history beyond a vague idea of where the island is and that it is, more or less, the academic center of Eorzea, possibly Hydaelyn and the homeland of the Archons.

2) Astrology: What's an astrologian without an understanding of the stars in the sky?  What's the cosmology of FFXIV?  We all know a little about different planes/dimensions, namely the Void, Thal's Realm, etc., and we know that Hydaelyn is referred to not just as a "world", but as a "planet" as well.  That being said, what do we know about the universe?  I assume Hydaelyn is in a solar system of some sort, but is it Ptolemaic (concentric spheres, geocentric) or Copernican (the modern conception, heliocentric)?  Furthermore, are all the stars in the sky other stars with their own planets and corresponding systems?  

2a) We know the source of aether on Hydaelyn (Silvertear), but is aether a planetary (exclusive to Hydaelyn) or a universal phenomenon?  In other words, something aetheric is clearly going on with the astrologians' magic, but is it star- and planet-focused aether in some way?  Is it simply stellar geometries (planetary positions, constellations, etc.) that provide for some aetheric manipulation akin to arcanima, or do the stars and planets in the sky/universe also produce, have, or otherwise influence aether?

2b) On that subject, what do we know about the Eorzean Zodiac?  Do we know specific constellations or the names of individual stars or planets?

I can't imagine I'm the only one with these sorts of questions and I apologize if you've all discussed all of this ad nauseam and I've somehow managed to miss all of those threads.  From what I've read, I didn't think that I was starting a redundant thread, but what do I know?

Thanks, folks.

RE: AST-related lore questions - Iex - 04-22-2015

Not a helpful answer but:

I don't have a clue about any of those questions....

I am sure someone will come along with a better answer than:

"As lore is revealed and I am sure the quest chain for Ast. will reveal some."

Curious myself.

RE: AST-related lore questions - Zhavi - 04-22-2015

(04-22-2015, 11:17 PM)Iex Wrote: Not a helpful answer but:

I don't have a clue about any of those questions....

I am sure someone will come along with a better answer than:

"As lore is revealed and I am sure the quest chain for Ast. will reveal some."

Curious myself.

Ditto on this. Don't know, but am curious. I also haven't read any threads with in depth speculation on specifics about astrologians, but I am very, very interested in seeing some start!

RE: AST-related lore questions - Sounsyy - 04-23-2015

(04-22-2015, 11:12 PM)Goodfellow Wrote: 1) Sharlayan:  Astrologians aren't Ishgardian!  Who knew?  I know very little of Sharlayan's history beyond a vague idea of where the island is and that it is, more or less, the academic center of Eorzea, possibly Hydaelyn and the homeland of the Archons.

Sharlayan is a city-state located on the Northern Isles in the Bloodbrine Sea. It is not technically a part of Eorzea. At some point during the 6th Astral Era, Sharlayan emissaries colonized a region of northern Eorzea, west of Dravania to build an "Eorzean" Sharlayan city-state to further study the Eorzeans. Hence why there's an island Sharlayan and an inland Sharlayan that you see on the Eorzean Map. This second, Eorzean Sharlayan was abandoned shortly following the Fall of Ala Mhigo 20 years ago after peace negotiations with the Garlean Empire failed.

More details about Sharlayan can be read in this very informative Tales from the Calamity.

Also, I'll link the original post detailing the lore behind Astrologian jobs being Sharlayan and not Ishgardian... here.


(04-22-2015, 11:12 PM)Goodfellow Wrote: 2) Astrology: What's an astrologian without an understanding of the stars in the sky?  What's the cosmology of FFXIV?  We all know a little about different planes/dimensions, namely the Void, Thal's Realm, etc., and we know that Hydaelyn is referred to not just as a "world", but as a "planet" as well.  That being said, what do we know about the universe?  I assume Hydaelyn is in a solar system of some sort, but is it Ptolemaic (concentric spheres, geocentric) or Copernican (the modern conception, heliocentric)?  Furthermore, are all the stars in the sky other stars with their own planets and corresponding systems?

There are other planets and moons out there. Likely an entire solar system, but there is very little lore on it. The sun is Azeyma, the moon is Menphina. The former... lesser moon, which orbited Menphina was Dalamud or "Menphina's Hound." There was lore from 1.0 stating it was believed that the Red Moon got its name because the Hound was Menphina's divine protector, and that it would bathe the heavens red if an entity tried to harm Menphina. We know now, obviously, that Dalamud was not a real moon.

As far as astrology goes... that's honestly about all the lore we have. There are stars that have names and constellations per lore, but we don't know what their names are or what significance they might have. Hopefully lore will be addressed in Heavensward detailing these things specifically.

We do know that much of what Eorzea knows of astrology is from an Ishgardian named Adaunel the Younger, who lived some 300 years ago.

Quote:#69 - The Observatorium
Three hundred years ago, Ishgardian astrologian Adaunel the Younger convinced the Holy See that he could predict the comings and goings of the Dravanian Horde by studying the movements of the heavens, and thus secured funding for the construction of the First Dicasterial Observatorium of Aetherial and Astrological Phenomena and its grand astroscope.

Quote:Star Globe
A spherical map of the heavens based off of legendary Ishgardian astrologian Adaunel the Younger's lifetime of findings.

I'm sure we'll learn much more about him in Heavensward as well. Hopefully.


(04-22-2015, 11:12 PM)Goodfellow Wrote: 2b) On that subject, what do we know about the Eorzean Zodiac?  Do we know specific constellations or the names of individual stars or planets?

Like above, we don't know any constellations or such. Besides the fabled "Dragon Star" discovered by Adaunel the Younger 300 years ago, we don't really have many names for other celestial bodies yet.

As for the Eorzean Zodiac... I'll refer you to this older thread on the topic:
The Zodiac and Lalafell

Not entirely conclusive, but it may help until actual lore is presented. Hope this helps! ^^ But it's honestly one of those- just gotta wait for Heavensward -things. There's currently not much in the way of lore on any of this stuff yet. I've been looking. =x

RE: AST-related lore questions - Goodfellow - 04-23-2015

(04-23-2015, 12:13 AM)Sounsyy Wrote: Sharlayan is a city-state located on the Northern Isles in the Bloodbrine Sea. It is not technically a part of Eorzea. At some point during the 6th Astral Era, Sharlayan emissaries colonized a region of northern Eorzea, west of Dravania to build an "Eorzean" Sharlayan city-state to further study the Eorzeans. Hence why there's an island Sharlayan and an inland Sharlayan that you see on the Eorzean Map. This second, Eorzean Sharlayan was abandoned shortly following the Fall of Ala Mhigo 20 years ago after peace negotiations with the Garlean Empire failed.

Oh Sounsyy, we can always count on you.  I figured details were scant, so I'll play the waiting game, but thanks for all the info you were able to offer.

A follow-up: would those Northern Isles be the same as the Sea Wolf homeland?  Not Sharlayan specifically, but would it be a part of the same island chain or archipelago that gave us our big salty roegadyns?

RE: AST-related lore questions - Virella - 04-23-2015

*flops about to add tiny bits not said yet*

Only constellation we now know of is the Halls of Halone. A silver star pattern within the sky.

[Image: 5kr9glw.png]

*flops back out thread*

RE: AST-related lore questions - Steel Wolf - 04-23-2015

Considering the absolute mass of stars visible in a clear night sky, I'm surprised that Astrologians from either area can read ANY damn thing. Hydaelyn would appear to be damn well near the center of the universe.

I'm not going to roll the class (Steel is way too stooped), but I am very curious about how the lore will fill in.

RE: AST-related lore questions - Sounsyy - 04-23-2015

(04-23-2015, 01:02 AM)Goodfellow Wrote: A follow-up: would those Northern Isles be the same as the Sea Wolf homeland?  Not Sharlayan specifically, but would it be a part of the same island chain or archipelago that gave us our big salty roegadyns?

Quite possibly, yes. Here's my reasoning:
Sharlayan is on an Isle in the North Seas. According to the Tales of the Calamity, the Students of Baldesion (who are Sharlayan) study at a place called the Studium. In the MSQ, the Students of Baldesion disappear with the entire "Isle of Val", yet, several patches later Moenbryda shows up from Sharlayan. Which leads me to believe that, like Limsa Lominsa, Sharlayan may be spread out over many islands. The main city-state might be on one, while its territory extends to the others.

I think the "Northern Isles" referred to in both Sea Wolf history and when Sharlayans speak of their homeland are one in the same. It's possible they are two separate island chains... but... it just seems kind of silly to say "We have Sharlayan on the Northern Isles, but if you go further north we have the More Northern Isles, and that's where Sea Wolves hail from."

RE: AST-related lore questions - Aduu Avagnar - 04-23-2015

From the Lore Panel:
Quote:Q: Are there any constellations in the night sky of Eorzea with any story to them?

A: Was planned for 1.0, there are constellations up there. Ishgard: astrologians, observatorium. Heavensward, will hear stories there. E.g. Monitor movements of the dragons by the Dragonstar.
#Pleaselookforwardstoit

RE: AST-related lore questions - Goodfellow - 06-21-2015

I haven't completed much of the AST questline yet, but already from the very beginning we're seeing constellations.  So, referring to my OP, I'm starting to see the blanks in question 2a and 2b being filled in.  Hopefully questions 1 and 2 will be answered by 60!

RE: AST-related lore questions - Gegenji - 06-22-2015

I only did the opening quest and the level 30 quest for AST before leaping back into MSQ progression, but the latter makes mention of a constellation at the very end of it - the Bole, a series of stars in the sky that symbolize a great tree. It also happens to be one of the cards you can draw from your deck (which gives a damage reduction buff!).

I haven't pushed any further yet - want to get SCH to 60 first before working on the other classes - but I wouldn't think it too far fetched to believe that the other cards are also matched to other constellations. So, there's likely constellations for the Balance, Arrow, Spear, Ewer, and Spire as well.

RE: AST-related lore questions - Goodfellow - 06-22-2015

Aha!  And in the 35 quest we get some more answers.  I'm not sure what will and won't be considered a spoiler from here on out, so I'll just tag it all.

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RE: AST-related lore questions - Goodfellow - 06-30-2015

Has anyone been taking screenshots of the constellations as they're introduced in the questline?  I realized today that while I recognize them in the night sky, I have trouble remembering which is which.

RE: AST-related lore questions - DreamedReality - 07-03-2015

I unfortunately missed the Balance. So if anyone has that, that'd be lovely.

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RE: AST-related lore questions - Goodfellow - 07-03-2015

Jaques, you magnificent bastard.  Thank you, that is enormously helpful.