Hydaelyn Role-Players
Qarn - And the "Far Older" Civilization - Printable Version

+- Hydaelyn Role-Players (https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/mybb18)
+-- Forum: Community (https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/mybb18/forumdisplay.php?fid=8)
+--- Forum: RP Discussion (https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/mybb18/forumdisplay.php?fid=13)
+--- Thread: Qarn - And the "Far Older" Civilization (/showthread.php?tid=10923)

Qarn - And the "Far Older" Civilization - Ryanti - 04-02-2015

So I've always been curious about the very interesting Qarn normal mode description that it has in the game. During the description, it speaks a little bit about the findings of the scholars that have been excavating the sight so far.

"Under the unforgiving Thanalan sun lie the ruins of an ancient temple half-devoured by the shifting sands of a timeless desert. Though used by ancient Belah'dians as a place to worship the sun goddess, Azeyma, the massive underground structure appears to be far older than this Sixth Astral Era civilization. That, however, did not deter Belah'dian sultans from each adding their own chambers to the original construct in a bid to achieve immortality through creation. In the subsequent years since the fall of Belah'dia, many an adventurer has sought to explore the temple's mysteries and perhaps return with the reassure of a loser era... only to fall victim to one of the complex traps set to prevent that very thing from happening."
—In-game description

The massive underground structure, and appearing to be far older than the Sixth Astral Era civilization. What exactly.. *is* this so called 'far older' civilization?

Has there been any other mention of this? You have Ul'Dah, which is still around, then Sil'Dih, which was a sister state to Ul'dah. They formed a divide because of a succession crises in Belah'dia. Which seems to be the first and oldest civilization in that desert until this comes up.

I don't think it's Allag. Allag is ancient on a whole other level, and this does not appear to be Allagan at all, or else I would probably be staring at an insanely-high technological chamber instead of what you see in Qarn.

What does it mean? Do they refer to the Egyptian-style architecture you see or was that placed there by Belah'dia? Anyone have any speculation or clues?

RE: Qarn - And the "Far Older" Civilization - Aduu Avagnar - 04-02-2015

Was touched on in the lore panel. We dont as yet have a name for it.

RE: Qarn - And the "Far Older" Civilization - Ryanti - 04-02-2015

(04-02-2015, 06:39 AM)Nakoli Chalahko Wrote: Was touched on in the lore panel. We dont as yet have a name for it.

I remember them mentioning something, but I forgot about what they said it was supposed to be. A black mage civilization or something?

RE: Qarn - And the "Far Older" Civilization - Aduu Avagnar - 04-02-2015

Correct.

RE: Qarn - And the "Far Older" Civilization - Aysun - 04-02-2015

I always wanted to know what race was represented in Qarn. Ever noticed the odd tails on the statues?

RE: Qarn - And the "Far Older" Civilization - Sounsyy - 04-02-2015

I actually asked this question for the Las Vegas Lore Panel. Fernehalwes didn't have an answer. There was a 5th Astral Era civilization existing where the ruins of Qarn are found today and that this mysterious nation of Black Mages sparked the War of the Magi against Amdapor and Nym, but it's name has been forgotten. Likely scrubbed out of history by those 6th Umbral Era survivors who sought to wipe Black Magic from history.

What's interesting however, was that after this nation's extinction during the 6th Umbral Era, the survivors of that great flood returned to Qarn (a holy temple used for sun worship) and founded Belah'dia. (So these people were also likely predominantly Lalafellin.) The lore that follows is that at the dawn of the 6th Astral Era, mages of all kinds were ostracized and outcast from the city-states. Magic was a hated practice, deemed as nothing more than sorcery and strictly outlawed. Belah'dia alone embraced the history of the Magi and was a city of magicks. Even though Black Magic was outlawed, Belah'dians reverted to their Thaumaturgy roots and began delving deeper into its study to create a deeper balance between its destructive force and its life restoring properties. This practice birthed the Order of Nald'thal and the start of the religion of the Traders, which has been borne down into both Belah'dia's children, Ul'dah and Sil'dih.

Cocobuki Wrote:Two scales, one of gold and one of silver. The gold of Ul'dah, weighing prosperity and power. The silver of Sil'dih, weighing knowledge and power. But the power sought by the two nations differed greatly - yes, greatly indeed.

In Ul'dah's flag you can see the Trader's golden scales weighing the Gem of Affluence on the left with the Flame of Magic on the right.
If Sil'dih were around today, their flag would be the Trader's silver scales weighing the Flame of Magic on the left and the Fruit of Knowledge on the right.

Ironic, right, that that combination is the key to opening the secret room in the Temple of Qarn... ;P
(Think I know who the favorite son was.)

[Image: hZfdHJk.jpg]

So if you'll recall, there was a fourth symbol: The Helm of Might. Why then, would a fourth symbol exist if the "surviving" nations only used three? Well, we can assume the Helm of Might was the symbol of Belah'dia. And perhaps because they were sunworshipers, the Helm of Might might have been wreathed in sunlight... very similar... to the portcullis in Ul'dah that Coat caught me studying a while back. It's a pretty door, but it's actually more than that.

[Image: 2LfmlU4.png]

Note what might be two coins, symbol of the Traders, wreathed in golden sunlight. Azeyma being the goddess of the sun. Qarn being a temple made to worship Azeyma. And Lalafellin worship of Azeyma may go back even further.

Quote:The Warden's Wand
There is an age-old Lalafellin faerie tale which tells the story of a trader eel who swam so far upstream that he eventually arrived at the very gates of the goddess Azeyma's palace. So impressed was the Warden with the wavekin's perserverance, that She gifted him with a cloak woven from rays of the sun.

Take out the fact that this is about an eel, and this makes a very compelling story of how a Sultan may have risen to rule in this ancient nation. Giving rise to the custom of traders gifting newly crowned Sultans fish as a coronation present. So while the name of this nation has been lost to time, its legacy of wisdom, affluence, might, and magic still lives on in Ul'dah.

Most of this is piecing together lore bits into speculation, but hope it helps! ^^

RE: Qarn - And the "Far Older" Civilization - C'kayah Polaali - 04-02-2015

One of the things I've noticed about Eorzean lore is the episodic nature of it. The ages don't really flow seamlessly from one to the other. They end with catastrophe, and new ages rise from them like foxfire from the ashes. I'd imagine there are a lot of civilizations, lost and vanished in the shadows of time, throughout the ages.

RE: Qarn - And the "Far Older" Civilization - Marisa - 04-04-2015

Really neat stuff. The way the lore of XIV is structured is very interesting, in how they scatter it in little hints throughout the land rather than directly telling it to us.  

Of course, I'm not all too fond of the constant and predictable pattern of astral and umbral eras, but you take the good with the bad.